[positronix]

Hello,

I'm very new to chemistry and I try to separate magnesium and silicon from talc.

I read that talc should be a strong base because it contains two hydroxide groups, is this right? So for neutralization and for an exchange reaction I tried this:

Mg₃Si₄O₁₀(OH)₂ + H₂O + C₆H₈O₇

But how should I calculate that what will form of this?

[TheUnfocusedOne]

Couple of questions:

Why are you trying to do this?  Both those are commerically cheap if your trying to save money.
What exactly is C₆H₈O₇?
Are you trying to neutralize the base?  You'll need an acid for that
What exactly are you asking for at the end?


More detail on what you're doing would be very helpful.

[positronix]

Couple of questions:

Why are you trying to do this?  Both those are commerically cheap if your trying to save money.
What exactly is C₆H₈O₇?
Are you trying to neutralize the base?  You'll need an acid for that
What exactly are you asking for at the end?


More detail on what you're doing would be very helpful.

I want to do this to see how it works, to learn. It would be boring to buy Mg and Si directly.

C₆H₈O₇ is citric acid.

Yes Im trying to neutralize it and tried it with citric acid.

I would like to calculate a reaction equation with the mentioned reactants.

I just read that hydroxides do not dissolve in water so I think this citric acid should help. But it might be to weak acid, I might need HCl but I don't have access to that.

[TheUnfocusedOne]

Well you have an ionic form of Mg, so you wont be getting pure Mg⁰ out of this reaction without some sort of reduction. 

Where are you getting your citric acid from?  HCl is also called Muric Acid (someone check me on that, I'm 80% sure on that), and you can buy it from most department stores. I would be careful with it though, and make sure you have some sort of neutralizing base around incase you spill.

I don't see your reaction proceeding the way you want it to be honest.

[positronix]

Well you have an ionic form of Mg, so you wont be getting pure Mg⁰ out of this reaction without some sort of reduction. 

Where are you getting your citric acid from?  HCl is also called Muric Acid (someone check me on that, I'm 80% sure on that), and you can buy it from most department stores. I would be careful with it though, and make sure you have some sort of neutralizing base around incase you spill.

I don't see your reaction proceeding the way you want it to be honest.

Thank you for your answer.

My citric acid is from pharmacy and it is meant for storing juices and berries. It is in crystalline form. I googled and found muriatic acid.

I did some research and made the following notes (please someone correct if I'm wrong or saying something wrongly:

- Talc contains phyllosilicate [Si_2nO_5n]^2n- , n=2
- The structure of talc is [Mg₃]⁶⁺[Si₄O₁₀]^4-[(OH)₂]^2-
- It is a hydroxide (2 OH groups) so it is not soluble in water

I think I should study the Lewis electron configurations for talc to see better how I could break the bond between Mg and the rest of the compund. As I said I'm new to chemistry so I may sound a bit naiive at times.

If I manage to break the bond and separate the Mg²⁺ ions in a solution then how should I "convert" the ions "back to atoms" ? Also please correct me if I'm writing like an idiot. Thanks 

[TheUnfocusedOne]

Well the Mg²⁺ is an ion (it's missing electrons, an atom has the same number of electrons as protos), which means to really isolate it you'll need a counter ion (in this example something with a negative charge to cancel the positive) of some sort.  I don't believe its possible to have pure Mg²⁺, if you try to isolate it from water you'll end up with Mg(OH₂)₂, or something similar (maybe hydroxyl instead of waters, it probably depends on the pH of the solution). If you want just Mg⁰, you'll need to reduce (give electrons to) the Mg²⁺.  There are plenty of methods of reducing molecules in solution. 

As I said before, I don't forsee this being a simple or cost effect method of getting pure Mg.

[vmelkon]

I don't think citric acid or hydrochloric acid would react with talc, since talc is a silicate.
Probably hydrofluoric acid would react with it. Yes, I know that you don't have it. Stores should not sell it since kids would just buy this stuff and throw it onto glass windows and cost $$$ to shop owners. It has happened in my city.

If you want to make magnesium, the usual method is electrolysis of MgCl2. The melting point is 714 °C.