May 07, 2024, 02:06:09 PM
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21
Organic Chemistry Forum / Re: Correct reaction?
« Last post by Meter on Yesterday at 07:20:42 AM »

You get an aldehyde from the ozonolysis, do you suggest that this can be oxidized to carboxylic acid with a peroy acid?
Is Bayer Villager not plausible?
22
So are they indeed sp3 hybridized?

I understood all of the examples that you wrote down. But here we have something different. It's a linear molecule and it only forms one bond. Also you gave HCl as an example and it resembles diatomic chlorine. But 100% of the sources say that HCl is unhybridized.

Because user azmanam said in https://www.chemicalforums.com/index.php?topic=37990.0 that it's really not.
He went on to give some bibliography: http://books.google.com/books?id=x6ct1xjyJpoC&pg=PA371&lpg=PA371&dq=vsepr+theory+chlorine&source=bl&ots=uB-xVEvcO3&sig=fvrKp9FyofKCWXYTEMaESxYUYiE&hl=en&ei=p3sWS6HoMtCWlAfHvvzMBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=3&ved=0CA4Q6AEwAg#v=onepage&q=vsepr%20theory%20chlorine&f=false

If I understood correctly d orbitals don't participate in the bond. So the book that I have at hand must have made a serious mistake

From stack exchange of the chemists: https://chemistry.stackexchange.com/questions/60238/what-is-the-hybridization-of-diatomic-nitrogen-diatomic-anything-like-oyxgen-b a users goes on to say that there is no need for hybridization to occur. I find his explanation very logical.

I know hybridization is just a concept to make sense of nature, but is it really applicable in here? Hybridization is useful whenever multiple bonds are formed, right? Hybridization of diatomic molecules seems quite silly to me. Does it really make sense for hybridization to be present in a single-bonded system?

Thank you for your time!

23
High School Chemistry Forum / Re: Electrolysis of saltwater to get NaOH
« Last post by Hunter2 on Yesterday at 06:48:23 AM »
But do it under a good ventilated hood or outside a building, because you develop poisson chlorine gas.

To be on the safe side use sodium sulfate ( develop oxygen) instead of sodium chloride.
24
High School Chemistry Forum / Re: Electrolysis of saltwater to get NaOH
« Last post by Five on Yesterday at 06:22:28 AM »
For the conductivity you put a amperemeter in series to the circuit. Don't dip your probes in the solution. Connecting a probe to the plus of the battery then connect the other one via a cable to the  graphite Anode. From cathode you go back to the minus of the battery. Maybe put a switch between to switch on/off.

https://media.sciencephoto.com/image/t3560597/800wm

The resistor is your cell.

The brine, water supply is needed for continously electrolysis. Why? What happen to your solution over time?

Container can be a your beaker in lab. But also a drum .

The membrane are called nafion membrane.

Thanks for the help  :)
I'll make sure to post my results here when I perform the experiment.
25
High School Chemistry Forum / Re: Electrolysis of saltwater to get NaOH
« Last post by Hunter2 on Yesterday at 06:13:51 AM »
For the conductivity you put a amperemeter in series to the circuit. Don't dip your probes in the solution. Connecting a probe to the plus of the battery then connect the other one via a cable to the  graphite Anode. From cathode you go back to the minus of the battery. Maybe put a switch between to switch on/off.

https://media.sciencephoto.com/image/t3560597/800wm

The resistor is your cell.

The brine, water supply is needed for continously electrolysis. Why? What happen to your solution over time?

Container can be  your beaker in lab. But also a drum .

The membrane are called nafion membrane.
26
High School Chemistry Forum / Re: Electrolysis of saltwater to get NaOH
« Last post by Five on Yesterday at 06:01:25 AM »
Read something about chlorine- alkaline electrolysis. There you will find you need a diaphragmatic membrane to separate cathode from anode.

https://www.fuelcellstore.com/image/data/Categories/chlor-alkali-process-schematics.jpg

For the calculation you need the chemical reaction. Develop it.
With Faraday you can calculate the  moles or masses of the developed gases and also with the moles the produced NaOH.

To show in the experiment add some indicator like phenolphthaleine in the cathode compartment . If NaOH is created you see a pink colour around the cathode.

How do I find the resistance of the mixture?? (since I know the voltage and I need the current for the faraday formula). Do I just dip the probes of my multimeter in it?

The image you provided (thanks) suggests I'd need to provide a constant supply of both brine and water, is that true and if yes how would I do that?

Also what kind of container is best for this,, and where can I get a diaphragmatic membrane?
27
d orbitals no need here. But flourine and also chlorine are sp^3 hybridisiest. The atomes have 3 free pairs of electrons and one is paired to another atome.

Compare the main atomes of  methane, ammonia, water, and hydrogenflouride
The same with Silane,  phosphane, hydrogensulfide and hydrochloric.
28
High School Chemistry Forum / Re: Electrolysis of saltwater to get NaOH
« Last post by Hunter2 on Yesterday at 05:46:26 AM »
Read something about chlorine- alkaline electrolysis. There you will find you need a diaphragmatic membrane to separate cathode from anode.

https://www.fuelcellstore.com/image/data/Categories/chlor-alkali-process-schematics.jpg

For the calculation you need the chemical reaction. Develop it.
With Faraday you can calculate the  moles or masses of the developed gases and also with the moles the produced NaOH.

To show in the experiment add some indicator like phenolphthaleine in the cathode compartment . If NaOH is created you see a pink colour around the cathode.
29
High School Chemistry Forum / Electrolysis of saltwater to get NaOH
« Last post by Five on Yesterday at 05:38:02 AM »
Hi! Im a highschool student looking to make caustic soda at home, as I have heard that all you need to do is electrolyse saltwater to make it and then boil the solution. I have tried this several times with the generic method of a 9v battery and using pencils shaved on both ends as "electrodes" but I couldnt make anything. Recently I have bought two 30cm graphite electrodes, a borosilicate glass beaker and 30 12volt batteries in hopes of doing the experiment properly.

TLDR: I want to make at least a visible amount of NaOH,, how can I do so without getting hurt?

Also, in faradays first law of electrolysis the weight in the formula would be the weight of chlorine and hydrogen gas being deposited on the electrodes,, is this also the weight of NaOH produced?? Thankyou.
30
Hello everyone! It seems nice in here.

I have been searching for a couple of days now and I keep finding unsatisfying information.
My book (not a universally known one) attempts to explain the fact that fluorine forms a weaker halogen elemental bond than chlorine by giving 2 reasons:
1) Closely packed electrons (I guess you have already heard about that)
2) Due to the lack of d orbitals in fluorine. All other halogens have these, which in turn participate in "the hybridization" (?) thus strengthening the halogen-halogen bond.

° So, does it really make sense for Cl2 to hybridize? Most sources say that hybridization doesn't take place (makes sense right? We are only forming one bond here. Why would we waste so much energy to make all the orbitals degenerate? What are we gaining energetically?).

° How exactly do d orbitals strengthen the bond? Is something like Pi backbonding (as referred to transition metals) taking place here? It makes me very uncomfortable to think about the d orbitals here because everything is so closely packed together (But I guess this logic doesn't apply here. Nitrogen can form a triple bond with ease and a very strong one indeed). Chlorine is not even that big of an atom, do the p-orbitals really share their inert electron pairs with the neighboring halogen's p orbitals?

Thanks for your time, I hope I didn't overlook anything.
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