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Specialty Chemistry Forums => Chemical Education and Careers => Topic started by: C6H8O7 on June 25, 2008, 03:29:28 AM

Title: Who's the boss?
Post by: C6H8O7 on June 25, 2008, 03:29:28 AM
What would one have to do to become their own boss in chemistry.I know you will always have people who fund and stuff checking on you every once in a while but i'm talking about just having the boss off your neck while you work.


Also would like to be able to research when I wanted to.My best work and ideas can come at 11pm or I can wake up and find a solution and need to get to the lab.

Is it possible to rent labspace from somewhere or something with that kind of approach and get grants to pay for your own projects?
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: P on June 25, 2008, 05:53:57 AM
I done exactly the same thing about 6 or 7 years ago and ran for about a year. I hires labspace at the local uni and put in some grant apps for business from the local government. I found, being so young and handsome and all, that people didn't really take me seriously and it was difficult to get them to part with their money for speculative research ideas. Investors want to fund finished products. I gave up after a year as my rental, insurance and other overheads were larger than the income. Perhaps I just not good enough as a sales person.

If you go for this can I make a suggestion that you probably wont like. If you don't have an existing idea which you have already proven and looks like it is going to make you money  -  i.e. if all of your ideas are still in the speculation stage and you have no working prototypes or any funding yet, then do something on the side as well. For example get a product you can sell business to business on a commission paid basis, or get a part time job until your business runs itself.

I work for someone else now and if I was ever to do this again I would have to have a product, some sort of cash cow to sell B2B to tide me over (because I'm not rich enough to just go it alone).

Good luck,

Regards,

P.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: enahs on June 25, 2008, 08:02:53 AM
The easiest way is to get a PhD and become faculty at a university, and then get really good at writing grants (and doing good science, of course).


Or win the lottery.

Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: Mitch on June 25, 2008, 01:38:10 PM
Being a graduate student is sort of like that. But, what you described is only possible once you  become a professor. Only 2-3 more years to go until I'm in that position.

Plus, there is no lab in this world that would allow you to work unsupervised that late at night, it is completely not safe if you're not scientifically trained, s#*$ happens.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: enahs on June 25, 2008, 03:39:10 PM
Quote
Plus, there is no lab in this world that would allow you to work unsupervised that late at night

I have to come in all the time and do hours of work in the middle of the night all by my self. Somethings are timed and no way to get around it. Damn reactions do not know decent sleeping times!

But it is never with anything toxic or all that dangerous. I mean, I guess I could break some glass wear and get a nasty cut, or fall and hurt my self; but that all holds true for my kitchen at home.



Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: macman104 on June 25, 2008, 06:13:16 PM
I think Borek's point was that an unaffiliated person who wants to rent out space to use for reactions would not be allowed this permission.  Obviously if you are working in a lab and are experienced things are different.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: SM30 on June 25, 2008, 06:22:59 PM
Tony f&#^$*@ danza, thats who.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: P on June 26, 2008, 04:36:26 AM
Quote
Plus, there is no lab in this world that would allow you to work unsupervised that late at night

I have to come in all the time and do hours of work in the middle of the night all by my self.

When I was doing my PhD I would sometimes stay to the early hours of the morning.  This was allowed IF there was also someone else staying late with you for H&S reasons.  It also helped that we had a lecturer that also stayed very late quite often.  If I was doing anything dangerous (or that had a reasonable risk factor to it  -  i.e. ANYTHING at all to do with working a chemistry lab) then I would pop into his office to let him know we were working late. He would pop his head around the door every hour or so just to check all was fine.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: Mitch on June 26, 2008, 06:08:13 PM
Sure, we all work late in lab, but I meant it would be unlikely for any lab to let outside members work late at night and unsupervised, especially with something potentially dangerous.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: macman104 on June 26, 2008, 07:37:38 PM
Sure, we all work late in lab, but I meant it would be unlikely for any lab to let outside members work late at night and unsupervised, especially with something potentially dangerous.
Err...yea.  When I said Borek above, I meant Mitch.  I just look at your pretty admin colored stars and take a guess at who is posting :D
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: C6H8O7 on June 27, 2008, 12:42:46 AM
The only problem I can see with me doing a solo thing is I'm not the greatest people person.I'm smart on paper but I like being able to revise and you really can not do that in realtime.

Maybe with a few grantwriting classes and a partner who did the talking something could work.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: Mitch on June 27, 2008, 01:58:16 PM
How old are you, how much science do you have under your belt?
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: SM30 on June 27, 2008, 04:49:59 PM
Mitch is asking a pretty important question here. If you're a B.S. level chemist or even M.S. level with only a few years of real lab experience, it's difficult to say you're proven to the point where an investor would even look at you. To apply for certain grants (if not all of them) you need a PhDs name on that app. In the world of business, how smart you are "on paper" really doesn't mean anything. If you want to actually come out with a product or service then production in the lab is all that matters. You could argue all non-theoretical chemistry is actually the same way. If the product isn't in that flask at the end of the day your synthesis doesnt mean s#*$. For example in custom synthesis no clients care about what route you put on paper to make their compound. If it doesnt end up in their hands, game over.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: C6H8O7 on June 27, 2008, 11:43:58 PM
I'm asking the question now before I end up being trapped behind a degree in something.Asking this question and having it matter after you have obtained your masters would be foolish.

I'm much different than most people regarding quite a few things.I work better when I feel I'm my own entity and am in control of the details of my life.Not letting others decide when I eat and sleep.Like I said before though I can meet a deadline and push myself to meet it.

I guess my next question is what kind of a difference in what you are allowed to do and not allowed as a scientist compared to a restaurant worker?As a construction worker if you stop and draw stuff out to make sure the product ends up better you would be reprimanded from the boss for wasting time that you could be working.If you are a scientist and you are just sitting down in deep thought about a problem is the "productivity police" going to assume you are just sitting around doing nothing?

If I stay up late at night at home writing tomorrow's report instead of doing it in the lab would I be reprimanded if I'm an hour late for work? For that matter if all you are doing is paperwork is it absolutely necessary that you do it at the job instead of at home?

I realize different people will have different types of jobs.I'm just curious as to what the standard day is like in a laboratory.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: billnotgatez on June 28, 2008, 03:23:29 AM
So you are trying to decide between writing the great American novel
Or
Being the loner midnight chemist

------

Just as an aside
There are home grown businesses that do chemistry like soap making
And maybe now bio-diesel
I even know of a person who make candles with soy oil - they said it takes some tricky chemistry to make them work
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: SM30 on June 28, 2008, 01:49:21 PM
before you think about starting your own business in chemistry you should probably see what its like to work in a lab. You rarely sit down in deep thought for days on end without getting anything done in your hood. If you're talking about the industry it depends where you work. Most places in big pharma or biotech are going to expect you to work an 8-9 hour day. Some companies have a harder working atmosphere though and you're expected to work 10-11 on average and when you have a deadline to meet you might be burning the midnight oil. Some places actually have a "productivity police" atmosphere and some are more relaxed. I've heard of places where people check each others notebooks to see how much work was done. I work at a place right now where they worry more about the hours. If you start your own lab though you can bet your ass you're working way longer hours than anyone else.

To answer your question its not likely that anyone reprimands you for showing up an hour late one day with a good report (when you're meeting the deadline). Nobody punches a clock in biotech/big pharma. People will keep an eye on if you're around the lab and stuff but as long as you get work done in a timely fashion its OK.

I wouldn't get worked up about being trapped behind a degree either. If you stay in science you can move around. After all your BS education is only 4 years of a 40 year career. It's not going to define your career.

If you want to start your own lab you should also keep in mind that you're responsible for far more than just science. You need to keep tabs on accounting, make sure you're up to code, with the eh&s,..etc.  Those things will all take time out of your lab time.
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: C6H8O7 on June 28, 2008, 06:43:14 PM
Thanks sm30 that answers quite a few questions I was having.These are things that are kind of difficult to find answers to short of asking those who are working there.

Ok now for my next question.If I was needing to complete something else personal for a period of time is there some opportunities for part time employment where a chem degree is useful?Would labs take you on as a part time lab tech or assistant part time.I wouldn't mind a severe paycut so long as the work is still in science related fields.

Notice I didn't say as a chemist so much as someone with a chem degree.

 I want to get into a field where if there is a situational change at some point im not resorted to throw out the degree and get a job at mickey d's lol
Title: Re: Who's the boss?
Post by: Mitch on June 28, 2008, 11:24:06 PM
Everyone hires lab techs, but they're only so useful.