Chemical Forums
Specialty Chemistry Forums => Chemical Education and Careers => Topic started by: deadally on February 10, 2006, 08:28:40 PM
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I am an undergraduate student majoring in Chemistry, 2nd year, and I am frankly ready to tear my hair out as to what I am going to do with chemistry. I hope some of you can relieve my frustration and inform me as to what could suit my likes in industry or otherwise.
I am currently in 2nd semester Organic Chemistry, and I find actually learning the material to be a joy. I find synthesis to be enjoyable when I know what I'm doing.
Unfortunately, I can't really stand the lab. I'm quite clumsy, don't know what's going on, spill things, cause eruptions when distilling, etc. I frankly do not enjoy it
Also, I am doing research in Cytochrome P450 using Modeling software under my professor in collaboration with a larger university in collaboration with an enormous project. I really like figuring out chemical problems (though not system administration...yuck!) using the software...analyzing data, designing protocols, etc. It's something I could see myself doing; unfortunately, I don't particularly care for Calculus and Physics enough to want to spend my life doing such things, and I imagine that actually pursuing a doctorate in computational chemistry would basically entail physical chemistry, which would include a more than desirable amount of physics and calculus.
I also adore spectroscopy, at least the analysis part of it...
After a long-winded and undoubtedly confusing preface there, I suppose I could summarize it all by saying I'm an analyzer. I don't like to do the labs, but I like realizing what happens and asking questions and pursuing answers. Is there a field specifically where I could combine my love for organic and modeling without subjecting myself to too much wet-lab work?
Thank you for your consideration. I want to get a lot of opinions on this matter, since it is obviously very important to me. I'm sorry if I put this in the wrong place, and I can't wait to become active in this community! It should be a blast!
Chemistry for life!
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Unfortunately, I can't really stand the lab. I'm quite clumsy, don't know what's going on, spill things, cause eruptions when distilling, etc. I frankly do not enjoy it
Just one thing I have to add here, only being in 3rd year Chemistry myself. One of the reasons you may not enjoy it is that you HAVE to do it as part of your course requirement, and as you say, usually we don't know entirely what's going on.
When you design your own synthesis experiment in an organic research lab to prepare say, an inhibitor for a certain enzyme, then you have to know EXACTLY whats going on, because you're the only one doing it. Plus, in many cases, you'll find RELATED work in a journal, but they won't be doing quite the same thing. You'll be the first (possibly ever?) to synthesize that particular molecule. That in itself can make a lab more interesting.
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That is the truth, isn't it?
I imagine labs really are like that out of school
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group leaders (ie profs, supervisors, etc...) will typically handle the analysis of data without doing any lab work. you cant be a group leader however, without first being a lab rat, sorry. the lab experience is absolutely essential when dealing with research data.
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I'm not sure how the educational system works in USA (or wherever you are), but maybe you should continue to pharmacology? Many branches of pharmacology/pharmaceutics do not involve labwork every day, and will allow you to work with analysis of different kinds.
I don't know the english word, but working as one who designs studies (both pre-clinical and clinical) on new drugs and analyze the data is something that springs to mind.
Perhaps pharmacodynamics and kinetics could be something you would enjoy?
Good luck!
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computational chemistry?
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I'd have to see how I like physical chemistry...
I don't much care for the physics and calculus, so I dunno how much I'll like it
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I'm still in my 2nd semester ( 1st year undergraduate ) and I must say that Organic Chemistry is by far the lowest form of scientific level out there. This field should be added to the biological "Sciences".
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Then you will not do well in that class, because you have completely missed the point.
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I'm still in my 2nd semester ( 1st year undergraduate ) and I must say that Organic Chemistry is by far the lowest form of scientific level out there. This field should be added to the biological "Sciences".
Well there's plently of "lowest form of scientific level" questions in the organic forum, and I havn't seen you answer many of them. ;D
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I'm still in my 2nd semester ( 1st year undergraduate ) and I must say that Organic Chemistry is by far the lowest form of scientific level out there. This field should be added to the biological "Sciences".
What do you mean by that?
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green-goblin, how do you expect me to answer any question in O.Chem when it's all about memorizing, not to mention that it lacks proof?
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Of course there is "proof". If someone asked you how does electrophilicity change down a main group, how would you answer? We tell students that the correct answer is that it increases down a group(memorizing). The real answer is that electrophilicity it directly proportional to the orbital quantum number for an element down the main group, along with other factors. This is all basic physical organic chemistry. If you have the time, movies or myself can forward you to some very interesting texts on physical organic chemistry.
A chemist who does not have the knowledge to be able to create and/or study interesting new molecules are typically uninteresting chemists, usually confused with physicist.
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A chemist who does not have the knowledge to be able to create and/or study interesting new molecules are typically uninteresting chemists, usually confused with physicist.
Hey! I got my degree in physics. :D
Maybe most of the students in organic chem are just trying to memorize everything. That doesn't mean that's what it is really about.
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;)
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green-goblin, how do you expect me to answer any question in O.Chem when it's all about memorizing, not to mention that it lacks proof?
You don't memorize in physical chem! Wow you worked out all the thermodynamics equations on your own, I’m impressed. You related to Gibbs?
In all areas of chemistry you learn rules which you have to have to memorize, you then apply these rules to problems so you can solve them. When you start doing some retro analysis you will see this applies just as much in organic as it does in physical.
Unless you’re the one doing the research and making the rules, which you’re not quite doing yet, all you are doing is memorizing.
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You don't memorize in physical chem! Wow you worked out all the thermodynamics equations on your own, I’m impressed. You related to Gibbs?
I'm not sure where you got that from. I didn't even bother mention physical chemistry. Oh and you seem to take this too much personal ... if you're an organic chemist, then it's pretty much understandable, just take it east mate :)
In all areas of chemistry you learn rules which you have to have to memorize, you then apply these rules to problems so you can solve them. When you start doing some retro analysis you will see this applies just as much in organic as it does in physical.
Unless you’re the one doing the research and making the rules, which you’re not quite doing yet, all you are doing is memorizing
So you're actually saying that deriving equations, solving differential equations, proving relations, and working out solutions are similar to memorizing the common names of carbon compounds in Organic Chemistry. There's interesting , I must say, and your logic seems to be very similar to the Medical students'.
Using your logic, I can conclude that Mathematics and Biology are just the same because afterall Mathemticians tend to memorize few formulas in geometry and analysis, right?
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Mark Kness, it's not the students' nor the instructor's fault. It's the material itself. Organic Chemistry just uses a few rules other areas of Chemistry as well as Physics, stamps the equations without even bothering explaining. Then the 'predictions' start with chemical rxns mechanism. Organic chemistry is like doing Physics in an extremely qualitative sense, it's more like an art to me. Even our Analytical Chemistry professor agrees that Organic chemistry is silly.
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So you're actually saying that deriving equations, solving differential equations, proving relations, and working out solutions are similar to memorizing the common names of carbon compounds in Organic Chemistry. There's interesting , I must say, and your logic seems to be very similar to the Medical students'
No memorizing common names of carbon compounds is the same as say, memorizing the definitions of enthalpy of formation and all that jazz.
Deriving equations, solving differential equations, proving relations, and working out solutions would be on the same level as an organic chemistry being shown a drug proposed by some fancy computer program which has never been seen before, and through reterosynthetic analysis be able to come up with a twenty step synthesis to make it. Organic chemists don’t have to learn compounds names, if you had two organic chemists one would be able to look at a brand new compound for the first time and give the other one a name so that he could understand the structure exactly.
I’m just saying, your in your first year and probably haven’t had much organic experience, in which case it’s a bit of a strong statement to say that organic chemistry is the lowest form of scientific level. It may be in the first year but you should give it more of a chance. Physical chemistry (I known you didn’t mention it in particular, I just assumed) isn’t a get a great deal harder in the last year as it is in the first, organic chemistry does get harder.
Btw, I’m not organic chemist, probally more into physical chem
;D
i just like a good debate. At the end of the day it's each to there own.
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You're right Goblin, my statement may have been a bit harsh, and I should have resorted to stressing on the importance of improving Organic Chemistry, at least according to me. Yet You can't convince me that O.Chem is gonna change for me in the 2nd or 3rd year, this is how it has been with me even since highschool.