. So what would our body use them for?I am not sure if you are asking me a question there? If so... - At the moment I am just trying ( struggling ) to keep the best “control” and record of what my Wife is consuming, along with carefully monitoring the resultant body weight.
.Unfortunately in my unusual case it is helpful to minimise as many uncertainties as possible. On the one hand Arkcon mentioned organic acid and an organic alcohol which leads me to a 7.1 x or 3 x , contribution. On the other hand he suggested the Human body would do nothing with them so a null contribution as you suggested with Choline
I see no reason to suppose that chlorogenic acid would be a source of significant calories.
... I think you meant ergogenic instead of ergonomic..Thanks, I am not sure how that wrong word crept in. I have corrected appropriately my Files.
...Thanks for that. I see at first glance no Nutritional value info there. But it does seem a good source for general info. I just tried searching for the sort of things i have been looking at, and they seem to have some info on all of them. So that is a useful link I was not aware of, Thanks
I highly recommend examine.com (http://examine.com) as a no nonsense starting point with these over-marketed substances...
The body can utilize only a small handful of chemical moieties for energy. .Thank you for all that. There is a an enormous amount of knowledge behind all that you have said there, and never the less you have “translated it” all in a way I think I can understand. I am very grateful.
..So, just for completenes, would a good "guess" or estimate be that for my
Each glucuronic acid is made from a glucose so by attaching it for excretion the body is giving up (a small amount) of energy.
.. it would be reasonable to roughly estimate this contribution as -1 x proportion glucuronidated x calories from one mole of glucose x moles of chlorogenic acid....This is extremely interesting. Since this morning ( yesterday now! ) I was thinking of writing a follow up here and suggesting as .
. for the "stolen" bit of glucose ).. – As it was stolen I was thinking may be it takes away what would have been used for energy, leading to a negative contribution ( and BTW, this could possibly be one “excuse” from the manufactures / suppliers of such products to market them as aiding in weight reduction )... I was too embarrassed that I might be talking in my ignorance total rubbish with that so I did not Post. .. And I re - read this a few times,
.... and was not sure in “giving up” meant burning in the process, or as I think it is now clear to me, “giving” up is “losing” That is clear to me now. Thank you.
Each glucuronic acid is made from a glucose so by attaching it for excretion the body is giving up (a small amount) of energy.
....You wouldn't directly use 4.1 as that is the calories from one gram of glucose..Is also somewhere along the lines of my
..a bit of 3 ( 3 for organic acid )So again it is helpful for you to confirm it with some technical detail but in a “language” that I can understand.
or
a bit of 4.1 ( 4.1 for the "stolen" bit of glucose )
.
. capturing this level of detail is extremely tedious and almost painful. .Yes I feel the pain sometimes.. Lol. I wonder sometimes if I am a bit of a masochist. Lol
I suppose it is useful as a purely pedogogical exercise, but including every such thing in any final analysis disproportionately complicates your model without providing you tangible benefit.
.Means that I am in error here
Many if not most of the utilizable "organic acids" are intermediates of the citric acid cycle and this chemical does not even resemble these.
For the most part we cannot utilize organic acids as energy sources. .
A good example illustrating this is tartaric acid. This strongly resembles citric acid cycle intermediates and certainly has plenty of potential energy which could be utilized if only we had the machinery. However, we just don't have this machinery. ..
There is no reason to use the "organic acid" calorie value as we do not think this chemical is utilizable for energy...
Those we can utilize tend to be utilizable because they happen to be an derivative chemical that we create as we utilize the energy bearing substances that are actually common in food.
A good example illustrating this is tartaric acid. This strongly resembles citric acid cycle intermediates and certainly has plenty of potential energy which could be utilized if only we had the machinery. However, we just don't have this machinery. .
. I don't really know how many kcalories are in a gram of tartarate but using the generic value of 3 for organic acids seems fine. .
.
Tartaric acid has caloric value. Perhaps around 3kcal/g.
...
This certainly looks like one of those small organic acids that the body will use for energy, having nothing but hydroxyls and carboxyls. However this does not seem to be the case. It appears to be predominately metabolized by intestinal microbes, and what does get absorbed is probably mostly excreted intact in the urine. I would say this has negligible calories.
I base this off of the entry in the Human Metabolome Database which may be a useful resource for you:
http://www.hmdb.ca/metabolites/HMDB00956 (http://www.hmdb.ca/metabolites/HMDB00956)
..Sounds an interesting and possibly important question. Beyond my abilities to comment.
Hmm a tangent question: If someone was given a large amount of a benign substance that was predominately glucuronidated would they readily become dangerously hypoglycemic or would the liver down regulate glucuronidation to avoid this?
...Possibly the manufacturers answer to that might be that it “starts some process of, which then continues.” Often in a Diet getting the Body to start using its fat reserve can be a stumbling point.
It would be darkly hilarious for a supplement marketer to claim that a substance would help you lose weight because the liver sacrifices energy in order to detoxify it via glucuronidation. Never mind that the ~1g of a pill would only amount to a kcalorie loss in the single digits..