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Is HCl synthesized in the body and released to the stomach?
Corribus:
--- Quote from: Borek on March 30, 2021, 10:09:06 AM ---Generally speaking there is no such thing as "HCl in water".
--- End quote ---
Right. This was a great articulation of where the problem lies, Borek.
Jfalken:
--- Quote from: Corribus on March 31, 2021, 02:58:52 PM ---
--- Quote from: Borek on March 30, 2021, 10:09:06 AM ---Generally speaking there is no such thing as "HCl in water".
--- End quote ---
Right. This was a great articulation of where the problem lies, Borek.
--- End quote ---
There is no "flaw" in my line of thinking.
You say you create HCl, show me a formula where it is actually created.
Leakage of chloride ions into the gastic juices combined with protons that being pumped out is not synonymous with creating hydrochloride acid.
We do not say HCl pump inhibitors, we say proton pump inhibitors.
And no, you do not have HCl in water, covalent bound, but in this case you never even had it from the start.
It is a misnomer and its scientifically incorrect to state that the body produces HCl when it is obvious that it does not...
Orcio_87:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrochloric_acid
--- Quote from: wikipedia ---an aqueous solution of hydrogen chloride. . It is a component of the gastric acid in the digestive systems of most animal species, including humans.
--- End quote ---
Babcock_Hall:
The source of the chloride ions in the stomach may be pertinent.
"This chloride ion is then transported into the stomach lumen via a chloride channel."
https://teachmephysiology.com/gastrointestinal-system/stomach/acid-production/
"Gastric acid secretion happens in several steps. Chloride and hydrogen ions are secreted separately from the cytoplasm of parietal cells and mixed in the canaliculi. Gastric acid is then secreted into the lumen of the oxyntic gland and gradually reaches the main stomach lumen.
"Chloride and sodium ions are secreted actively from the cytoplasm of the parietal cell into the lumen of the canaliculus. This creates a negative potential of -40 mV to -70 mV across the parietal cell membrane that causes potassium ions and a small number of sodium ions to diffuse from the cytoplasm into the parietal cell canaliculi."
https://www.clinicaleducation.org/resources/reviews/the-role-of-hcl-in-gastric-function-and-health/
Jfalken:
--- Quote from: Orcio_Dojek on May 15, 2021, 12:41:45 PM ---https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hydrochloric_acid
--- Quote from: wikipedia ---an aqueous solution of hydrogen chloride. . It is a component of the gastric acid in the digestive systems of most animal species, including humans.
--- End quote ---
--- End quote ---
I do not think we are going to get any further than this in this topic.
If wikipedia suggests that it is simply an aqueous solution of hydrogen and chloride, then I guess we can just make it from acetic acid and NaCl.
If it is an aqueous solution of hydrogen chloride however, it is not the case of the gastic juices.
We can basically just say that whatever H2O solution that we have, with whatever we might have in it, and be classified as hydrochloride acid as long as we have protons and chloride ions in it..
--- Quote from: Babcock_Hall on May 15, 2021, 01:16:15 PM ---The source of the chloride ions in the stomach may be pertinent.
"This chloride ion is then transported into the stomach lumen via a chloride channel."
https://teachmephysiology.com/gastrointestinal-system/stomach/acid-production/
"Gastric acid secretion happens in several steps. Chloride and hydrogen ions are secreted separately from the cytoplasm of parietal cells and mixed in the canaliculi. Gastric acid is then secreted into the lumen of the oxyntic gland and gradually reaches the main stomach lumen.
"Chloride and sodium ions are secreted actively from the cytoplasm of the parietal cell into the lumen of the canaliculus. This creates a negative potential of -40 mV to -70 mV across the parietal cell membrane that causes potassium ions and a small number of sodium ions to diffuse from the cytoplasm into the parietal cell canaliculi."
https://www.clinicaleducation.org/resources/reviews/the-role-of-hcl-in-gastric-function-and-health/
--- End quote ---
I think that in physiology, they can say that this is the case whereas in chemistry, we can not say that this is the case.
The difference between biology and chemistry, in simple terms.
Biochem is somewhat of a mix between the two fields that can not really decide if they are more biologists or chemists, much like how you do the counting on fatty acids (from the methyl or from the carboxylic acid end).
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