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Topic: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases  (Read 16417 times)

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Offline minimal

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Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« on: January 10, 2008, 11:54:51 AM »
Quick question about the similarity between acids and bases and reducers or oxidizers...
Are all bases oxidizers because they will accept a proton and thus reduce whatever other chemical? Or are they not oxidizers because they are merely accepting a hydrogen proton without an electron, while oxidizers must accept the electron as well?  Or are some bases oxidizers while others are not?  If this is the case please elaborate.
Also I am assuming the exact opposite can be said about acids and reducers (ie, acids are reducers, acids are not, some are some aren't, for the same reasons listed)

Offline Borek

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2008, 12:22:50 PM »
Giving or accepting proton is not enough to be oxidizer or reducer. There is no change in oxidation states, so there is no oxidation/reduction.
« Last Edit: January 10, 2008, 02:08:21 PM by Borek »
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Offline minimal

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2008, 01:20:08 PM »
Right, but much of the time there is oxidation or reduction taking place in an acid/base reaction correct?
For instance, I understand that there is no redox in HCl + NaOH.  But if CH3COOH is in a basic medium and becomes CH3COO- then it has been oxidized correct?

Offline Borek

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2008, 01:56:50 PM »
No, it has beed neutralized.
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Offline minimal

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2008, 02:19:57 PM »
so when I said, "Or are they not oxidizers because they are merely accepting a hydrogen proton without an electron, while oxidizers must accept the electron as well?", that was the answer?

Offline Borek

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2008, 03:26:53 PM »
Intuition tells me that this phrase can be falsified by some reactions (although I have no example at hand; that's just a feeling), that's why I refrained myself from simply saying "yes".
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Offline minimal

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2008, 03:47:37 PM »
Fair enough, thanks.

Offline Kryolith

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2008, 04:41:58 PM »
Is your question whether a base can be an oxidant?. Of course an oxdiant must be an electron acceptor, but it can be a proton acceptor (=base) as well.

A lot of anions (which derive from acids) are common oxidants, although they are bases and have no acidic character. For example ClO- or MnO4-. Correct me, if i misunderstood the problem.

Offline minimal

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Re: Connection between reducers/oxidizers and acids/bases
« Reply #8 on: January 11, 2008, 11:28:18 AM »
Is your question whether a base can be an oxidant?. Of course an oxdiant must be an electron acceptor, but it can be a proton acceptor (=base) as well.

A lot of anions (which derive from acids) are common oxidants, although they are bases and have no acidic character. For example ClO- or MnO4-. Correct me, if i misunderstood the problem.


Well, would it be correct to say that oxidants can only be lewis bases, instead of bronstead lowry?  Because a Bronstead lowry base is purely a proton acceptor, so how can it be a base if it is not just accepting a proton, but a proton and an electron?
Also, aren't your examples salts?  I was under the impression that you can have acidic or basic salts but they're not really classified as acids or bases per se?  If that is incorrect then I have another issue with it, on completely the opposite spectrum (so obviously I'm wrong in at least one way, likely two :o).  How is there a change in oxidation state taking place with your examples? If they are replaced with hydrogen then that is still more electropositive than the nucleophile and no oxidation change is taking place, correct?
Like I said obviously I know I'm wrong on at least one front.

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