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Topic: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?  (Read 5610 times)

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Offline potatopotato

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Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« on: February 26, 2008, 09:35:39 PM »
I know this is impossible, kind of...

If i were to burn carbon dioxide (even though it won't really burn cuz the fire will die out), what would happen to the carbon dioxide gas and what will be the chemical equation or reaction of this...

Thx
potatopotato

Offline azmanam

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2008, 09:43:34 PM »
combustion of organic materials is the complete oxidation of, in this case, carbon by oxygen.  hydrocarbons are oxidized to CO2 and oxygen is converted to water.

How much further would you like to oxidize CO2?  What will it oxidize to?
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Offline potatopotato

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2008, 09:49:53 PM »
Absolutely true, I believe in your point that carbon dioxide does not combust any further...

But in my yeast lab, which i posted another question earlier, the lab asks me to after massing the bag of fermented yeast+sugar+water , i will have to burn splint and record observations...I suppose it expects the fire to wither due to presence of carbon dioxide from fermenting of yeast anaerobically...then it asks me to measure mass of fermented yeast+contents again...So i was wondering if that means there is a mass change in the bag of yeast and contents after burning for presence of carbon dioxide.

thx
potatopotato

PS wow you helped me clear things up a lot today azmanam, scooby snacks for you for sure :P

Offline azmanam

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2008, 09:52:29 PM »
without reading through the entire procedure, I don't really understand what this step is about.  Maybe someone else knows better?  If it's truly anaerobic (doubtful without expensive precautions), there will still be trace oxygen in the bag.  burning splint in closed system will exhaust remaining trace oxygen.
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Offline potatopotato

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2008, 09:55:13 PM »
you got a point, thank you for noting that out, source of error (still some oxygen in bag)

Therefore, according to what you said, i burn the oxygen still left in bag, hmmm...

Thank you

potatopotato

Offline Arkcon

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2008, 07:10:08 AM »
This is (or was) a common procedure in molecular biology.  You would culture microbes in a sealed container, that contained a lit candle.  As the candle burned out, it exhausted most of the oxygen in the system, suitable for growing microaerophiles,  in your case, you're fermenting yeast, but this procedure is used also for human pathogens.  It's a pretty big surprise, for many people, that the interior of the human body has very little free oxygen, our cells snap it up too efficiently.

Yeast are facultative, if they have oxygen, they'll consume nutrients and grow in size and reproduce.  Without oxygen, their enzymes simply consume glucose to ethanol and CO2 -- you're probably going to measure one of these products, and it'll be easier to quantify, if not muddied by the myriad of products produced by aerobic growth.
Hey, I'm not judging.  I just like to shoot straight.  I'm a man of science.

Offline azmanam

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2008, 08:10:42 AM »
Quote
As the candle burned out, it exhausted most of the oxygen in the system, suitable for growing microaerophiles

Quite true.  Good point.

Reading the OP in the yeast fermentation question, though, it appears the procedure asked the student to burn the splint after fermentation is complete.  It would make sense to me to burn before fermentation begins to help remove oxygen, but burning after seems like it won't help fermentation any.

Could the question be aimed to help the student qualitatively determine the nature of the gas in the bag after fermentation (assuming anaerobic conditions throughout from beginning to end), and to realize the gas in the bag is not the same as ambient air?
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Offline azmanam

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Re: Burning Carbon Dioxide, is it possible?
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2008, 08:13:44 AM »
Quote
If it's truly anaerobic (doubtful without expensive precautions), there will still be trace oxygen in the bag.

That's not exactly what I meant to say, and I apologize if it came across as confusing - because it's technically wrong.

What i meant to say is that if the fermentation is NOT truly anaerobic (LIKELY without expensive precautions), there WILL still be trace oxygen in the bag.

If the fermentation WERE anaerobic, there should be no oxygen in the bag, and nothing to support combustion.

Sorry if my post was confusing, but I think you got my general point.
Knowing why you got a question wrong is better than knowing that you got a question right.

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