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Topic: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content  (Read 6659 times)

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Offline anibajaj

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How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« on: May 31, 2008, 02:04:40 AM »
Hello,

Would be grateful if someone could help with this. I have an emulsifier/surfactant made from the polymerization between Polymerized glycerol/Polymerized glycerine and Polymerized Ricinoleic Acid (Castor oil derivative). This emulsifier has a water content of less than 1%.

How can I concentrate this emulsifier? If I simply distil, I would only remove a small portion of the already minimal water.

Would polymerizing both the Glycerine and the Ricinoleic give me a more concentrated product? Or can I use a distillation method that distils the more active part of the emulsifier? Could any polymerization experts come up with a solution?

I hope I am making sense.

Thanks,

Ani


Offline macman104

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2008, 02:07:51 AM »
I have no idea if it applies, but can you simply use some sort of drying agent (MgSO4, CaCl2, etc.) to remove the water?  Then simply filter out the drying agent?

Offline anibajaj

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2008, 02:11:55 AM »
The 1% water "reduction" will only give me a 1% increase in concentration. I need a concentration of another 30%. Any thoughts?

Offline macman104

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2008, 02:18:13 AM »
So, you have the:

water
emulsifer
what else do you have in there?

I suggested the removal of water since I was under the impression it was just your water and emulsifer.  What else is in the mixture?

Offline anibajaj

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2008, 03:35:27 AM »
There is nothing else except the ready to use emulsifier, and the less than 1% water that remains after the reaction is complete. The water isn't really the issue because it is so minor.

The real question is how do I make this emulsifier more concentrated- it can't be water removal since there is barely any. I was hoping a polymerization expert could address this issue and suggest how a polymerized product can be made more concentrated. Would polymerizing the Glycerine more do the trick?

Sorry it is a loose question, and possibly peculiar to the product in question and can only be answered by someone who has researched it.

Always hoping someone may come through..


Offline Borek

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #5 on: May 31, 2008, 04:28:01 AM »
There is nothing else except the ready to use emulsifier, and the less than 1% water that remains after the reaction is complete. The water isn't really the issue because it is so minor.

You are contradicting yourself - if in your mixture there is nothing but 1% water and emulsifier, it can't be made more concentrated. After you remove water you are left with 100% emulsfier, aren't you?
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Offline DrCMS

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #6 on: May 31, 2008, 05:34:03 AM »
The product you have can only be concentrated by 1% and you already knew that.

Your only other option is a different emulsifier which may or may not work in your end application.

What you need to do is some development work yourself and stop asking stupid question here hoping for a miracle.

Offline anibajaj

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #7 on: May 31, 2008, 06:12:43 AM »
DrCMS,

You are a charmer...

Offline Gerard

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Re: How to concentrate a chemical with minimal water content
« Reply #8 on: May 31, 2008, 07:44:35 AM »
try to experiment,plot a water content reduction vs. the oil concentration.....and find the equilibrium line...
if the plot falls below the equilibriumline then thats the fartherst you can purify..
-you can use the ethanol-water analogy..
when you distilll water-ethanol mixture the farthers you can get is somewhere between 90 to 95 % water....
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