April 25, 2024, 07:21:43 AM
Forum Rules: Read This Before Posting


Topic: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??  (Read 16335 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline saman_Z

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
  • Gender: Female
for instance oxide is (O)2- while peroxide is (O-O)2-
Similarly manganate is (MnO4)2- and permanganate is(MnO4)- . Why are they named so?? ::)

Offline Dungsbars

  • New Member
  • **
  • Posts: 4
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #1 on: December 29, 2008, 02:39:44 PM »
Per means higher oxidation state. MnO42- has Mn at +VI, while MnO4- has Mn at +VII. O2- has O at -II, while O22- has O at -I.

Offline ARGOS++

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Mole Snacks: +199/-56
  • Gender: Male
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #2 on: December 29, 2008, 03:11:51 PM »
Dear Saman_Z;

You can find a lot about this Nomenclature, if you search on the Internet for:   
prefix per peroxide permanganate

Good Luck!
                    ARGOS++


Offline macman104

  • Retired Staff
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1644
  • Mole Snacks: +168/-26
  • Gender: Male
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #3 on: December 29, 2008, 03:53:07 PM »
Using ARGOS's search, it appears that originally it was used for acids that were formed from Hydrogen Peroxide or release it upon treatment with sulfuric acid.  You read the first few pages of this book:

http://books.google.com/books?id=kxFDAAAAIAAJ&printsec=titlepage

But I suppose what you are really asking is why do we use the prefix "per" and not..."foo" or whatever you want.  That may or may not be online, or it may be one of those relics that no one knows why it's called per, not sure.

Offline ARGOS++

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Mole Snacks: +199/-56
  • Gender: Male
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #4 on: December 29, 2008, 04:09:11 PM »
Dear macman104;

For “per-” see on:    http://www.affixes.org/p/per-.html
                     or :   http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/per-

Good Luck!
                    ARGOS++

« Last Edit: December 29, 2008, 04:23:17 PM by ARGOS++ »

Offline macman104

  • Retired Staff
  • Sr. Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1644
  • Mole Snacks: +168/-26
  • Gender: Male
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #5 on: December 29, 2008, 06:09:57 PM »
Thanks, that's what I was looking for.

Actually, that first link looks exactly like what you want.

Offline saman_Z

  • Regular Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 9
  • Mole Snacks: +1/-0
  • Gender: Female
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #6 on: December 29, 2008, 11:29:57 PM »
thankyou so much, ARGOS++  and MACMAN 104!!!!! :)..

Offline ARGOS++

  • Sr. Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1489
  • Mole Snacks: +199/-56
  • Gender: Male
Re: what is the logic behind adding the prefix 'per' to the names of ions??
« Reply #7 on: December 30, 2008, 03:23:29 AM »

Dear Saman_Z;

You’re welcome!   ─   Soon again.

Good Luck!
                    ARGOS++


Sponsored Links