[Doc.AElstein]

  Question: Where would you place Sucralose in an all inclusive list of Organic “things” people might consume..
Questions Summary:
_ 1) Other than a “sweetener” or a Sugar substitutes, what might be a slightly more technical name for a group to which it might belong

_ 2) What might be the “thing” listed  above and below it.

For Example
_ 3a) It is not, I believe, Saccharose ( which i have in my list ) , but might it ( because it is ”made” from that )  be well  listed next to it?
Or
_3 b) I have “sugar alcohols”, Mannit ( Mannitol ),  Sorbit ( Sorbitol ), Xylitol also listed. Would it be better there in a section for Sugar substitutes? ( I have a feeling not, - but i am not a Chemist )
_3 c) or somewhere completely different, deep down in the micro Food supplements where just a very minute amount of “thing” is consumed
......

A bit of background to explain my reason for the question...hope I do not bore, I will not make a habit of making a “Wall of Text”. I thought the first time around it might help ..!
  I am busy developing a sort of Diet software for private use to help my Wife with her very necessary and very detailed diets. I am trying to make some sense of the whole jungle of macro and micro Nutrition. I am trying keep it practical,  but also, out of interest,  a bit scientific. I would like to keep some order in all the listings I am making of all my Wife “eats” as it were.
  I start at one extreme with the main macro stuff: / Total Kcal, Fat, Protein, carbohydrate, of which Sugars, etc.. and at the other end I have Food supplements where just a very minute amount of “thing” is consumed. In the middle come things like Vitamins, minerals etc. I have some 3000 “things” listed and amongst other disciplines, I have some things from reading up on organic chemistry. Along the way i try to break down Fats , carbohydrates, Proteins ( amino acids ) etc. into their constitute forms.
 So I have a pretty thorough list, if somewhat unconventionally based ( and a bit messy at the moment! ).
 My question is a bit vague, as i am crossing different disciplines. So I am just looking for any Thoughts on what other “things” Sucralose might belong to, or come close to. As I briefly understand it, Sucralose originated as a Sugar, but is modified to something that is no longer a carbohydrate. I cannot seem to get enough info ( that i can understand ) to decide where best to place it in my Lists.
 No rush here, I have been working on this part time now for over a Year. Any help would be appreciated.

I have some Excel files where i am attempting some order in all these “Things”. They are a bit big and messy at the moment. For this question have just a  much shortened, simplified .png.  ( The “Things” listing I have transposed from my normal Nutrition Protocol. ) I
Tried some more detailed screenshots, practicing in the “Sandbox?” Thread, Reply #88,
http://www.chemicalforums.com/index.php?topic=64128.msg303901#msg303901
- they are very difficult to see, but just give a quick indication of my “attempts”!!!

Thanks
Alan Elston
Bavaria
Germany
...

Small Section of Transposed Things List:

IMG

[MOTOBALL]

It is synthesized from sucrose----so list as a derivative of sucrose.

Regards

[Doc.AElstein]

Hi MOTOBALL,
     Thanks for the Reply.
     I have no Chemistry background, but did Google that it was “discovered” or “made” by changing something in Sucrose. 
     So placing it next to ( after )  sucrose would be a reasonable place for me to list it, before Maltose, even though it is not a Carbohydrate  ( I think ? ), ?
    Or can you or anyone think of any similar “things” that  might be grouped near Sucrose   that find their way into things we might “eat” – I had collected about 3000 things and tried to put them in some sort of logical order, but somehow had missed sucrose ( Unfortunately i cannot supply my main list as it is in a very  large  Excel File

Thanks again

Alan Elston

( P.s. I just thought I might be able to knock out a  text list of my current “Things” grouping, if it is a help to anyone )

[Dan]

It's a chlorinated derivative of sucrose. So I suppose you could call it a chlorosugar, chlorodisaccharide etc.

It is not a carbohydrate in the strictest definition of the term, but it is a carbohydrate derivative.

I'm not sure if this is a very helpful classification based on your application though. Are you grouping chemicals in according to structure or nutritional value? If you are concerned with nutritional content, then sucralose has essenially no nutritional value as it is very poorly metabolised in humans. Non-nutritive sweetener is perhaps more appropriate, and it could be grouped with other non-nutritional food additives.

[Doc.AElstein]

Hello Dan,
  Thank you very much for  replying..

.. Are you grouping chemicals in according to structure or nutritional value? .. Non-nutritive sweetener is perhaps more appropriate, and it could be grouped with other non-nutritional food additives.

I do not really have a Chemistry or Biology background, but am trying very hard to keep some sort of logical order, but with no specific criteria. Very crudely at the “Left” ( or “Top” ) I start with the “Big” or “Main”, “Energy giving Food” , and then  at the “Right” ( or “Bottom” ) am trying to include things like phytochemicals or various other Nutritional supplements that have little or no nutritional value. But in this last “no nutritional value” end i have a jungle of “Things”, and am struggling really to make some sort of ordered list.

  Interestingly, after your comments, I had another look and I just found myself very deep down ( Line 1570 ) an entry i must have made some time ago after reading an Old Organic Cemistry Book for sucrose. It is deep down in the mostly non nutritional value area, in a section that I for some reason named “Glucoside&co.” or “derived von glucose”.  So subconsciously I may have been thinking of sucralose then, and something along your  and   “derivative of sucrose “ – I do not have any of the other “sugars” , ( “__saccharides”) there.

 I have tried to help explain by writing a program to generate a transposed listing of my column heading of “Things” into a simple text document. I fear it is a bit messy and as it is in simple black and white text not particularly helpful, but possibly an experienced eye might see immediately a “line where sucralose might fit in”
 Each line represents a header name of a “Thing”.  In my actual Excel File i allow up to 20 header rows, that is to say I have for each “Thing” the possibility to spell it or name it slightly differently. Therefore some lines are long, others my just have a couple of words. Empty rows are where I have strained my brain to guess where I might be adding later. Interestingly again around my  “derived von glucose sucarose” I left a lot of spaces... I confess I wonder and confuse myself sometimes with my own logic – somehow I unconsciously guessed that something like sucrose might exist before i had come across it!?!!!

 Thanks very much for the reply. Every little helps me to get some better idea of how to organise my List. ( And i was reminded that Sucrose is a Di saccharide )

Alan Elston

 Text File - Transposed List of “Things” headings: “ThingsTransposedForChemicalForums.txt”
https://app.box.com/s/f7if1ry5i8tcgq3yq96lwljn23bnvnla

[Borek]

trying (..) to keep some sort of logical order, but with no specific criteria

This is self contradicting.

[Doc.AElstein]

Hi

trying (..) to keep some sort of logical order, but with no specific criteria

. is self contradicting.

  Maybe I just meant “some sort of order.” As I mentioned I am covering so many disciplines that I cannot simplify it to specific criteria. I am trying to have just as many “things” there as I may need to keep control of ( I mean by that maximum daily consumtion ). I do not want to just use something like Alphabetical order.
 As I have it there could be a few criteria in play at the same time. Starting with “Biggest” or main at the “left” or “Top”. going to the smaller at the “right” or “bottom”. Another criteria is maybe just trying to “group” things that for some reason or another “belong” together or could be considered to belonging to a similar type , or “coming” ( derived from) something similar.

  I read lots of Biology and Organic Chemistry books, wore my eyes out looking at Nutrition info on Food stuff  and Nutritional supplement labels, read info I got from manufacturers, etc. etc.  then did a bit of internal brain storming in my head and then came up with my current list. After Dan and MOTOBALL’s comments I then found I may have already had a section where to place sucralose. I just do not want the list to be totally random. When an experienced person throws in a few names, or words like “derivative” it helps a bit to point me in the ( some! ) direction.
 
Alan